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The President Donald Trump Thread

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You are reading page 584 of The President Donald Trump Thread. If you want to start from the beginning Go to First Page.

15 minutes ago, MoondoggieRN said:

That’s what it said in the NYT article the other poster referenced.

The only NYT article I found was regarding endangered species. Could it have been the Washington Post?

Quote

...   A USCIS official said the change will have little to no effect on those who already have permanent resident status who are seeking to become naturalized U.S. citizens. “Naturalization applicants are not subject to a new admissibility determination and therefore are not generally subject to public charge determinations,” said the official, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because the official was not authorized to speak publicly...

...  Details of the rulemaking proposal are still being finalized, but based on a recent draft seen last week and described to NBC News, immigrants living legally in the U.S. who have ever used or whose household members have ever used Obamacare, children's health insurance, food stamps and other benefits could be hindered from obtaining legal status in the U.S.

Immigration lawyers and advocates and public health researchers say it would be the biggest change to the legal immigration system in decades and estimate that more than 20 million immigrants could be affected. They say it would fall particularly hard on immigrants working jobs that don't pay enough to support their families.

 https://www.washingtonpost.com/immigration/trump-administration-aims-to-make-citizenship-more-difficult-for-immigrants-who-rely-on-public-assistance/2019/08/12/fe3f8162-b565-11e9-8949-5f36ff92706e_story.html

Here is the current text of the 837 page draft of the unpublished Rule by the Homeland Security Department on 08/14/2019:

Quote

There is nothing definitive yet, so people who have waited years to enter the country legally and then waited for their Green Card are worrying and waiting. Attorneys are advising green card holders not to apply for citizenship because any past infraction can be used to deny citizenship and take away their Green Card too.

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6 minutes ago, herring_RN said:

The only NYT article I found was regarding endangered species. Could it have been the Washington Post?

Here is the current text of the 837 page draft of the unpublished Rule by the Homeland Security Department on 08/14/2019:

There is nothing definitive yet, so people who have waited years to enter the country legally and then waited for their Green Card are worrying and waiting. Attorneys are advising green card holders not to apply for citizenship because any past infraction can be used to deny citizenship and take away their Green Card too.

“Officials said the program would not apply to people who already have green cards, to certain members of the military, to refugees and asylum-seekers, or to pregnant women and children.“

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/12/us/politics/trump-immigration-policy.html

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44 minutes ago, MoondoggieRN said:

“Officials said the program would not apply to people who already have green cards, to certain members of the military, to refugees and asylum-seekers, or to pregnant women and children.“

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/12/us/politics/trump-immigration-policy.html

Thank you. I did not find it.

I want to post the entire paragraph and the one preceding it:

Quote

...   Poor immigrants will be denied permanent legal status, also known as a green card, if they are deemed likely to use government benefit programs such as food stamps and subsidized housing. Wealthier immigrants, who are designated as less likely to require public assistance, will be able to obtain a green card.

Officials said the program would not apply to people who already have green cards, to certain members of the military, to refugees and asylum-seekers, or to pregnant women and children. But immigration advocates warned that vast numbers of immigrants, including those not actually subject to the regulation, may drop out of programs they need because they fear retribution by immigration authorities...

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/12/us/politics/trump-immigration-policy.html 

My neighbor and their son are citizens. The mother holds a Green card, but can no longer work due to dementia. The father hired an immigration attorney who told him that even though she is collecting Social Security and Medicare insurance that she paid for when working  she would not attract the attention of ICE unless she applies for citizenship. She is a college graduate, but could not pass a citizenship now due to her illness.

I cannot advise him not to worry unless the "Inadmissibility on Public Charge Grounds" document is finalized. Glad he has an attorney. Glad that attorney told him it should be OK for her to continue using her Medicare. 

A couple times a week I go visit with my friend of 45 years so her husband can take a shower and have a little time to himself. She could wander and get lost. She has lost two expensive partial dentures this year. Sadly when she sees me she smiles and introduces herself to me, who she has known for decades.

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1 hour ago, MoondoggieRN said:

And, will save the government $57 billion a year.

I didn't see this figure in the NYTimes article. Is this available somewhere else? 

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4 hours ago, herring_RN said:

Our neighbor across the street is worried. He bought their house in 1970, a year after we bought ours. He had a green card and worked two jobs when we first knew him. His brother and family lived there then. He was saving money and paying an attorney to help his wife, still living with her parents in Mexico, so she could legally come to the USA. After a few years she was allowed a visa to come and live here. Their son was born in 1974. He is now a retired police officer.

In 1886 his mother got a green card, his Dad became a citizen, and he graduated from the police academy. After 30 years he retired and now works at a store.

Now they are worried she could lose her residency status because for several years she worked part time and paid her taxes, Social Security, and Medicare payments. She pay for her Medicare insurance, a supplement, and part "D" pharmacy insurance. So far there is no way to know whether or not someone like her will be deported or not. Until the text of the regulations are available they don't know whether they can stay in the USA. 

The Trump administration is expected to issue a proposal in coming weeks that would make it harder for legal immigrants to become citizens or get green cards if they have ever used a range of popular public welfare programs, including Obamacare, four sources with knowledge of the plan told NBC News.

Where is the text of the proposal stating it will not apply to current legal residents, including Green Card holders? She waited in Mexico for years so she could come legally.

 

Isn't it interesting that so many free loading immigrants are arrested at their places of employment? ICE efforts and raids look a great deal like government harassment of an ethnic group that they are also concentrating in overcrowded detention camps.

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3 hours ago, MoondoggieRN said:

And, will save the government $57 billion a year.

I'm also curious where you're getting that number from, but it's suspiciously similar to one put out by CIS, a far right anti-immigration group, which even the right-but-less-far-right group the Cato Institute pointed out was intentionally misleading.  But not even the CIS use of the manipulated number went so far as to claim immigrant-headed households take out more than they put in to the system.  Overall, immigrant-headed households contribute about $300 billion per year to 'government assistance' programs, so even if we take the $57 billion per year number as valid, it's still clear that immigrant headed households contribute more than they cost.

I'm certainly not opposed to the requirements of financial independence or at least the clear potential for financial independence that green card status and naturalization already requires, but it's not clear that the current Trump administration proposals would do anything other than cost American taxpayers more money, rather than save them money.   Under the proposal, those who while here under a greencard, needed some form of assistance but then become financially independent after initially 'paying their dues' in a low paying job would be denied citizenship, even if at the point of application they are now able to contribute far more than they take out.  From a fiscal perspective, that's just stupid.  

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1 hour ago, MunoRN said:

I'm also curious where you're getting that number from, but it's suspiciously similar to one put out by CIS, a far right anti-immigration group, which even the right-but-less-far-right group the Cato Institute pointed out was intentionally misleading.  But not even the CIS use of the manipulated number went so far as to claim immigrant-headed households take out more than they put in to the system.  Overall, immigrant-headed households contribute about $300 billion per year to 'government assistance' programs, so even if we take the $57 billion per year number as valid, it's still clear that immigrant headed households contribute more than they cost.

I'm certainly not opposed to the requirements of financial independence or at least the clear potential for financial independence that green card status and naturalization already requires, but it's not clear that the current Trump administration proposals would do anything other than cost American taxpayers more money, rather than save them money.   Under the proposal, those who while here under a greencard, needed some form of assistance but then become financially independent after initially 'paying their dues' in a low paying job would be denied citizenship, even if at the point of application they are now able to contribute far more than they take out.  From a fiscal perspective, that's just stupid.  

I found that number on the website of David Harris Jr., who seems to have a show on YouTube and who is CEO of a supplement company.    https://uncorkedliving.com/pages/about-us

He also  quotes from Brietbart, who edited a tape regarding Shirley Sherrod to state the opposite of what she actually said and did.     

Quote

President Trump is making a move on handing out green cards to immigrants who will need welfare to survive. This could affect 300,000 current green card holders and prevent them from applying for citizenship. Every year, it costs US taxpayers over 57 billion dollars on welfare benefits for legal immigrants, who are allowed to migrate here without any means of self-support...

 https://www.davidharrisjr.com/steven/president-trumps-latest-immigration-move-will-save-taxpayers-billions/ 

 

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2 hours ago, toomuchbaloney said:

Isn't it interesting that so many free loading immigrants are arrested at their places of employment? ICE efforts and raids look a great deal like government harassment of an ethnic group that they are also concentrating in overcrowded detention camps.

I am curious how much the US government spends on free-loading, native-born, White folks living in eastern KY.

I learned today, while training for my new public health position, that KY, is home to 20, of the top 100, poorest counties in the country.

No doubt, those are in the eastern part of the state, also known as, "Trump Country."

 

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Oh, and while you all are calculating the cost, of so-called free-loading immigrants, could one of you, calculate the price tag of the gun violence, to our country, by angry, White men?

What is the cost of hospital bills?

How about lost wages?

Children placed in foster care?

The cost of counseling services?

The cost in trials, lawyers and incarceration?

The cost of disability?

Funerals?

Insurance claims?

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Here is the first lawsuit, challenging Trump's attack on legal immigrants.

From CNN:

Rule Targeting Legal Immigrants Draws First Lawsuit

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13 hours ago, Lil Nel said:

I am curious how much the US government spends on free-loading, native-born, White folks living in eastern KY.

I learned today, while training for my new public health position, that KY, is home to 20, of the top 100, poorest counties in the country.

No doubt, those are in the eastern part of the state, also known as, "Trump Country."

 

Good to see someone with empathy for this population is going to be providing public health services to these folks.

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You have to love Trump's tool in USCIS who suggested that people like Ted Cruz have no right to citizenship.  Didn't Cuccinelli once compare immigrant families to rats a few years back in an interview? He implied that you could breakup rat families but that wouldn't end the infestation.  That dehumanizing and derogatory tone appears to be a requirement in this xenophobic administration.

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