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New way to look at Adam and Eve

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http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rabbi-manis-friedman/new-twist-old-story_b_2017349.html?ncid=edlinkusaolp00000009

I get HuffPo religion on my fb and found this article thought provoking. Did they disobey God, or did God plan for them to react that way? Was God using poor parenting skills by telling them what would happen if they did eat rather than make it an absolute?

I have always thought, well perhaps not all my life, but certainly after I learned parenting skills, they if you give an absolute you don't give room for "if you do".

You don't tell a child not to pick up broken glass because "If you do you could get cut". You say "Don't pick up broken glass."

I would appreciate others thoughts on this article and how it relates in other areas.

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We (my mother and I) have been having a similar theological debate lately.

First let me attempt my standpoint on your exact posed question. I believe God to be infallible, perfect in every way, and without blemish. I also believe that man was created with 100% free will. So when I posed this question to a bud in seminary, he said this,...and it stuck with me.

God created a perfect lush oasis for his two newly minted humans. They were to never know hunger, sickness, loss, or death. The ONE stipulation placed onto them was to not eat from The Tree of Knowledge (or the the "forbidden fruit"). In doing this, after spending most of their life "totally taken care of" in the garden- they made a choice to defy, or to be in rebellion of God through satisfaction of their temptation. I understand that God also faced temptation throughout scripture- but withheld from acting on it.

Let's look at that temptation of the Garden(the only one facing them then(because NO other LAW existed). They were tempted to be "like" God(thus, know the difference between Good and Evil; Whether through the fault of the weakness of the flesh(still a conscious choice), or the serpent(Satan), they are fully responsible for their consequences. They were (1) Made aware of the one Law of the Garden, and (2) of their own free will ate of the forbidden fruit. The parenting in my opinion was sufficient,...and even "merciful."

Watch this. Remember, the first feeling they experienced was "nakedness" and thus shame. They used leaves to cover their "tender bits," and hid from the presence of their father (God) whom walked with them in the Garden at evening. He killed an animal, and made them more sufficient clothing- so that they would be more comfortable. Death was their consequence, but it wasn't immediate. He was still concerned with their feelings despite the direct rebellion.

I think the story that is often viewed as "tragic" is also one of much Grace and Redemption, eventually so much so that like man, God would become flesh, and pay the cost of their sins so that the separation created between him and man in the Garden could be destroyed, and he would again walk with man.

So, the story ends where it began, one day- we will again wonder a perfect recreation of Gods non-blemished creation, free of our bent to sin, where all things are "new," despite our rebellion in the Garden, he has never turned his back on us, nor at the Cross. I couldn't ask for a better father who even though it was in no way his fault, eventually even gave his own life so that we may have eternal life through him once more(suffering our consequence).

The wages of sin from Genesis to Revelation have always been death, but in him we are blameless of our sins. Now, the bible also states he is also a God of Wrath. We clearly see his wrath in the Garden, and throughout scripture. He is also Love, and his wrath will come to pass eternally, hopefully soon. This is just my thoughts, and what I believe. I promise to respect the beliefs of others who would differ I faith or lack of, and have no desire to make a judgment here:)

Edited by BostonTerrierLoverRN

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I believe that because I need to. I need to believe that in this world of chaos, hurt, and pain- there is something pure and good. I had a rebellious streak earlier in life almost costing me everything, and I am so far from perfect. I am liberated from the scripture that tells us not to judge others, and that has opened my heart up to love even the "Unlovable." So, now that I have learned from my consequences, and practiced being a "repentant" man, I have a heart for people, and their pain, disappointments, and shortcomings- because I have been there, and I made it back- I am not narcissistic enough to believe I did it alone. And, when I watch the news, I just have to trust in a pure divine force that loves us, and wants the best for us, for NOTHING in return. I have to believe that to get out of bed.

If I am wrong- I have lost nothing, but hopefully, if right- I have gained eternal life by no cost of my own to pay. That's raw- and the mass of my 30 years of searching and seeking a higher power.

We are human and we will disappoint, fail, and even discourage other humans looking to us for encouragement, but my belief is God is infallible- big enough to take our worst anger and rage, and answer it with blessings, peace, and love. He is a BIG GOD who answers BIG prayers. I just have to believe this:)

Lastly, and to better answer your question, I believe even the smartest, wisest, and most learned follower of God has only one grain of sand on a beach of the understanding of God and his Will. In know one day we will understand the hard things humans faced all through scripture, and even now. But I can face it all knowing one day it will end, and things will be "made new," and the old things will pass away. What better promise from a father to a child could I ask for?

Edited by BostonTerrierLoverRN

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I found the article very worthwhile reading because I was raised to believe much as you describe. I never thought of God as evolving and learning better ways of handling situations. If we do have free will than oviously God is going to have many challenges from us. We find new ways of following our own drummer, as it were, daily. I am not sure some of these are not predestined, I have no idea. I do think it is interesting how things do together. Whethr you put that into relious terms or free will terms it does cause one to think, if one wants to. I love reading the Rabbinical explanations of things. These scholars have a tradition of deep thinkers. Most of us never think so clearly about much of anything. I find no issues in being Christian and reading Jewish literature, especially Rabbinical discussions.

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My fear is that if I was raised in Islam, or Buddhism, or any other world religion- would I be seeking a "different" God, as "my" God -or- just my own picture of God? That is why I studied hard in Seminary the different Views of God as the "Creator" and came to fully follow the God of Abraham in the Judeo-Christian tradition- because I understand this is

(1) a religion totally devoid of your earning heaven (it's given freely-can't be 'earned')

(2) One of the few faiths where man doesn't become god or god-like, but instead- God, the Creator became "like" man- and accomplished all that needed be accomplished for us(again- nothing needed in return but a decision to accept his gift of eternal life), and alas

(3) the fact that he is "good," and "pure." He desires nothing but "good" and "purity" for us. Pain, sadness, heartache, and all negative things are a result of the fall of the Garden.

I applaud your study of Judeo-studies, as I now in my heart believe this is the one true God. My heart is open, my mind is still open, but as I said, if I am wrong- I hope I never find out as all of the miracles I see (sunrise and set, the scent of a flower, emotion, births, music, stars, the vastness of the universe, the beauty of a woman)- all to be by chance, by a big "bang."

No, I have to believe in a Divine Hand in this.

I love your answer's Theology as well:)

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I love the Huffington Post now, I never knew about it until my cultured friends here talked about it so much, y'all will have me "caught up" one day soon:)

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Two humans, who had no knowledge of good or evil, were tricked by the devil (because they had no knowledge of good or evil), and a loving all-powerful god punished them and all subsequent generations... until the god manifested himself as a human and then sacrificed himself to himself to save (some of) us from his wrath.

Sounds legit.

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I am an atheist. Agnostic Athesit to be specific. Which is a fancy way of me saying I try not to gamble.

I have seen seen countless interpretations of Adam, and Eve. Even thought of a few of my own. The problem is nobody knows.

I have a problem with guessing. Faith if you want to call it that. I prefer wrestling with the empirical, because it makes me feel as if I am actually doing something.

I used to be a huge meaning of life guy. I would spend countless hours thinking about it. After years I simply realized I would never know in this life. So I stopped worrying about it, and I try to focus on what I can know/effect.

You can call me a coward for that, but it helps me maintain focus on what I want in life. Rather than worry about what is beyond my control.

Everybodies different though, and I think that is a good thing.

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