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2018 Elections

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You are reading page 46 of 2018 Elections. If you want to start from the beginning Go to First Page.

Completely agree that there is no shortage of incompetent politicians.

Currently, the United States is in the middle of two catastrophes.

The first, is yet another mass shooting, while the second are the wildfires in CA, which have killed nearly two dozen people.

What is the old man focused on?

Stirring up the base and political divisions, by declaring fraud, where there is NO evidence of fraud.

A true leader, would be focused on the catastrophes that have claimed human lives.

A true leader, would reassure Americans, that the checks and balances, enacted 18 years ago, will help ensure the integrity of our elections.

A FAKE leader, fans the flames of division.

A FAKE leader, goes for the short-term gain.

Trump is nothing more than an incompetent failure.

Shame!

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I agree with you. The poster answered the question from the politicians views and what they are doing.

If we had to buy into everything our politicians say and do then there would be no one to vote for. Sadly it was one of the reasons I didn't vote as a young gay man in the 80's as they all were pretty homophobic back then and no one would stand up for me and change things. Even as I started to vote, I voted for Clinton who broke his promise to end the ban on gays in the military and for Obama who did not support gay marriage (he evolved).

I know some Trump supporters in real life, mostly at work, and come across them all the time as patients. I wouldn't necessarily put the qualities of "sexist, racist, homophobe", etc. on them, although some do hold these qualities. Most seem like quite fine people.

Mostly, i don't like what they turn a blind eye to and what they accept. Al Franken had to resign for stuff he did long ago under pressure mostly from liberals, yet conservatives push through Kavannaugh to the Supreme Court "because why did she wait so long? It's just what boy do."

I also don't like the ignorance (meaning lack of knowledge of the truth) of some one of them. Such as "Obama separated parents from their children the same as Trump did", "Obama imported 10,000 Muslim terrorists via New Orleans" (said by a person here and one that I always go back to), or even something like "Democrats want open borders".

I believe people when they show me who they are.

If you support a racist, sexist, homophobic, I believe you are showing me your values, and thus, who you are.

You seem to give people who defend the indefensible, the cover they are seeking.

It reminds me of the White Nationalists who are clean-shaven, clean-cut, polo wearing young guys, because they know the non-threatening look makes them palatable.

Gee, that White Nationalist looks like my neighbor, and he is a good guy.

Cover is exactly what they are looking for.

I've yet to meet a fine racist, sexist, homophobic person.

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I believe people when they show me who they are.

If you support a racist, sexist, homophobic, I believe you are showing me your values, and thus, who you are.

You seem to give people who defend the indefensible, the cover they are seeking.

It reminds me of the White Nationalists who are clean-shaven, clean-cut, polo wearing young guys, because they know the non-threatening look makes them palatable.

Gee, that White Nationalist looks like my neighbor, and he is a good guy.

Cover is exactly what they are looking for.

I've yet to meet a fine racist, sexist, homophobic person.

Um...no. If they identify as a White Nationalist, then that's what they are.

If they identify as "Republican" it means a lot of things to a lot of people. That's like saying those that supported Hilary or Killary are "muderers, liars, communists and cheats". Just doesn't fly with me. Like I said, I voted for homophobes Clinton and Obama and that doesn't make me one. I just align more with their overall agenda.

But I get what you're saying. Trump has given a voice to a lot of racists, etc.

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Um...no. If they identify as a White Nationalist, then that's what they are.

If they identify as "Republican" it means a lot of things to a lot of people. That's like saying those that supported Hilary or Killary are "muderers, liars, communists and cheats". Just doesn't fly with me. Like I said, I voted for homophobes Clinton and Obama and that doesn't make me one. I just align more with their overall agenda.

But I get what you're saying. Trump has given a voice to a lot of racists, etc.

If you are talking about old school Republicans, such as John McCain, or George W. Bush, I would agree.

But I thought we were talking about Trump supporters.

Anyone, who currently supports that vile man, does indeed need to be called out for what they are.

There is no mistaking where he stands on a number of issues.

There are posters on this site, who continue to defend his every move and vile remark.

Yes, they can be judged by the actions of the politician they support.

Comparing Obama, or Clinton to Trump is ridiculous.

They would have to be compared to the Republicans I mentioned.

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There are posters on this site, who continue to defend his every move and vile remark.

Nope, I have not seen regular posters here defending his every move and vile remark. Yes, there has been the occasional troll, but even those who are in agreement with some of DJT's policies have disagreed with some of his statements and tweets.

I don't understand why you feel the need to keep attacking people on this board. Do you think you are going to win them over to your viewpoint? Or do you just think you are going to drive them off with repeated insults? If so, you are the only one, that I can tell, would be in favor of that.

I have written more than once that I appreciate hearing other viewpoints, even when they don't agree with mine. I don't feel threatened by a difference of opinion.

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Nope, I have not seen regular posters here defending his every move and vile remark. Yes, there has been the occasional troll, but even those who are in agreement with some of DJT's policies have disagreed with some of his statements and tweets.

I don't understand why you feel the need to keep attacking people on this board. Do you think you are going to win them over to your viewpoint? Or do you just think you are going to drive them off with repeated insults? If so, you are the only one, that I can tell, would be in favor of that.

I have written more than once that I appreciate hearing other viewpoints, even when they don't agree with mine. I don't feel threatened by a difference of opinion.

I am not trying to drive anyone way.

Has anybody left?

Have I attacked anyone personally?

I was attacked personally.

I was called angry and bitter, among other things. A direct, personal attack.

Funny, I don't recall you stepping in to stop the personal attacks.

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Nope, I have not seen regular posters here defending his every move and vile remark. Yes, there has been the occasional troll, but even those who are in agreement with some of DJT's policies have disagreed with some of his statements and tweets.

There are posters who defend *almost* every vile action and remark. One or two will say "I don't approve of everything he says," yet they rarely will identify anything specific and NEVER speak out on their own to condemn an action or comment or tweet coming from DJT on this forum.

Trump was serious when he said he could shoot someone on 5th avenue and not lose voters. He wasn't implying they were simply loyal, he was implying that they were engaging in blind allegiance. I don't care who we are talking about, that kind of "loyalty" is inappropriate, and as history has shown us time and time again, is very dangerous to democracy.

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I am not trying to drive anyone way.

Has anybody left?

Have I attacked anyone personally?

I was attacked personally.

I was called angry and bitter, among other things. A direct, personal attack.

Funny, I don't recall you stepping in to stop the personal attacks.

I wasn't driven away, but I did leave for a couple of days once biting my tongue as I know was another poster.

Was sad to see a long-standing thread of mine got closed down.

Bitter and angry describes me and a lot of us, so perhaps I missed those direct personal attacks against you. Frankly I'd rather have a direct personal attack, rather than a blanket statement that "you're support of him says a lot about you" round about personal attack. Sometimes we get what we give.

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There are posters who defend *almost* every vile action and remark. One or two will say "I don't approve of everything he says," yet they rarely will identify anything specific and NEVER speak out on their own to condemn an action or comment or tweet coming from DJT on this forum.

Trump was serious when he said he could shoot someone on 5th avenue and not lose voters. He wasn't implying they were simply loyal, he was implying that they were engaging in blind allegiance. I don't care who we are talking about, that kind of "loyalty" is inappropriate, and as history has shown us time and time again, is very dangerous to democracy.

I on occasion point out things I don't like about his actions. Would would the point be to do it all the time? To convince you he's a dirtbag and to not support him or his agenda?

How many here have never spoken up about things that are going well under his presidency?

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I am bitter and angry at times, too. And if someone picks up on that and points it out, that I try to reflect on that to see if I was hurtful to another poster. If I think someone is crossing the line with remarks toward me, I report them. And if it continues, I ignore them. I refuse to play the victim.

As to the thread topic, our state has been the first to pass tough control laws. Washington state voters approve tough gun control measures - CBS News

It imposes new age restrictions, imposes a 10 day purchase waiting period, and holds gun owners responsible for safe storage. I really didn't think it would pass, and I hope it holds up in court.

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Are we all supposed to cheer when the bully fascist enjoys a good bit of news?

Nah

The overall theme of this presidency is simply too dangerous to be that naive.

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I have written more than once that I appreciate hearing other viewpoints, even when they don't agree with mine. I don't feel threatened by a difference of opinion.

I don't feel threatened by a difference of opinion either. While it's true that a difference of opinion could actually pose a threat, if enough people shared it and the opinion they shared was corrosive enough to dissolve the fabric of your democratic society, opinions isn't what have me feeling quite scared for you all and the rest of the world.

The thing that scares me more than anything is that you/we no longer agree on verifiable, demonstrable truths and facts. In my opinion it started when Spicer angrily claimed in January of 2016 that the inaugural crowd was the biggest ever. PERIOD.

Trump's inauguration crowd: Sean Spicer's claims versus the evidence | US news | The Guardian

It's only gone downhill from there.

The posting of links to sources that peddle outright lies. The starting of threads that cover the latest fake topic that those in power want to foist upon you. And how they abandon that thread as soon as the administration and the more extreme elements of the right-wing do so. It is so obvious when the lie du jour has oulived its usefullness.. They are so clearly a megaphone helping the propaganda department along.

This is the threat and this is what infuriates me when I read posts made by the staunchest Trump supporters on this forum. I can't call them out by name, because that would likely be viewed as a personal attack. I wish I could, because I much prefer being straight with people and giving them a chance to respond and explain if they want to.

Difference of opinion I can handle. The perpetuation of lies and conspiracy theories that threaten to tear your country apart, is a different kettle of fish.

I find some Americans so very naive.

I'm Scandinavian and of course that also makes me a European. I've lived in over a dozen countries, both as a child and as an adult. I've lived in several European countries apart from my birth country.

Europeans have had two devastating world wars on their soil in the last ~hundred years. We've also seen the rise of several fascist or authoritarian regimes. We've had Hitler, Mussolini and Franco. Millions of people killed. Several countries have had civil wars during the twentieth century. We've had the iron curtain that split our continent in half. We've experienced genocide as recently as the nineties.

Today we're seeing troubling signs of authoritarian leaders gaining power in many of our countries and a growing intolerance towards the "others". With the sum of that collective experience affecting how I interpret the world, what I see happening in the U.S. really frightens me. While you as a country have participated in many wars, no one alive today has ever experienced war on your own soil. I think many Americans take freedom and democracy for granted.

(@nursej22, I know I quoted your post when I started my post, bit somewhere along the way this post morphed into being directed at everyone and no one in particular.

I don't intend for this post to come off as me trying to lecture you).

The problem here isn't a difference of opinion. It's that you can't even agree on what is true and factual. As a country you are alienating your traditional allies and expressing admiration and sucking up to authoritarian leaders. You are withdrawing from international treaties designed to make the world a better and safer place for ALL OF US.

I watched someone on the TV the other day say something that I think was a very accurate conclusion. I can't remember who the person was or what his qualifications are, but he was in my opinion right. He said that Trump views the world as a zero-sum game. In his mind if it's France +2, that automatically means that it's U.S. -2. That of course means that he has to lash out at France in one form or another. He can't grasp the fact that multilateral deals and cooperation between countries actually leads to France +2 and U.S. +2.

Nope, I have not seen regular posters here defending his every move and vile remark. Yes, there has been the occasional troll, but even those who are in agreement with some of DJT's policies have disagreed with some of his statements and tweets.

It's definitely true that no poster has ACTIVELY defended each and every lie or vile remark. The thing is though, if a poster repeatedly links to obviously inaccurate sources (ie LIES) and keeps on doing it even after it's been pointed out to them, AND they defend let's say a third or a fifth (or whatever percentage) of the lies and vile remarks, I WILL draw my conclusions. I don't require a 100% perfect track record.

It's not primarily the opinions that bug me, it's the willingness to embrace and perpetuate lies and the refusal to cede even an inch, even when they are demonstrably PROVEN to be wrong.

How many here have never spoken up about things that are going well under his presidency?

No, and unless things drastically change, I don't think it's likely you'll see it happen. Back in the day when I'd regularly placed people under arrest, I would rarely celebrate the fact that Perp101 that I nabbed for assaulting John, Matt and Peter, didn't also beat up Mike and happened to have donated $100 a worthy charity the morning of the assault.

Sure, giving money to a charity is a good thing and I guess that at least Mike could argue that not being beaten up is a good thing. But ya'know.... I was still kind of miffed that Perp101 had beaten John, Matt and Peter. So I didn't place an ad in the local paper recognizing Perp's generous donation. (I'm not claiming that the things Trump does are the equivalent of felony assaults (or any kind of crime). My example was just to illustrate good/positive vs bad/negative deeds and why you in some instances won't get much credit even when you manage to perform the odd positive act. I haven't in honesty seen that many of them, just trying to be generous here).

The overall theme of this presidency is simply too dangerous to be that naive.

I could not agree more.

Edited by macawake

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