Seven new taxes on those making less than $250K - page 2

by tntrn

2,065 Unique Views | 26 Comments

While we were all debating the cost to our liberty due to the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act (Obamacare), we were ignoring the cost to our pockets. If there ever was a reason for bipartisan rage about this law, it... Read More


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    AKY, with the new health care bill someone could purchase health insurance online while waiting for the ambulance. I have health insurance through my job and have always paid my bills including paying for my daughter's birth when we didn't have insurance. Everyone should have health insurance but I can easily see why the CBO estimates 3 million people at or below 500% of poverty level will chose to pay the tax instead.
  2. 0
    Quote from azhiker96
    The law says that people can either purchase health insurance or they can chose to pay the tax. I'm not suggesting that folks are going to break the law. They will do what makes the best economic sense to them. From the link in aknottedyarn's post, the CBO estimates that 1.2% of the population, 4 million people, will chose to pay the tax in 2016.

    Why do you think that many people would chose to pay a tax which provides no coverage versus just purchasing health insurance which does provide benefits?

    I'm just suggesting that people will game the system if it gives them an economic advantage. I think people should all have health insurance. There's just some problems with the law that the CBO recognizes.

    Here's the link again. CBO Estimates Only 1.2% of Americans Will Have to Pay Healthcare Penalty ‹ I Acknowledge Class Warfare Exists
    Perhpas I'm confused then that's it's 1.2% rather than 1.2 million. Still in my mind a 98.8% compliance/or not applicable is still pretty good.

    As Romney says "all the Supreme Court said was it's not unconstitutional, but it's still bad policy."

    No matter how it plays out...as written or if Romney is elected and it's dismantled someone is going to get screwed, someone is going to be unhappy, someone is going to take advantage and profit.

    No one in my facility, that takes care of a lot of unfunded patients (unfunded means no funds...no insurance, no medicare/aide, doesn't quality for anything, no help from the county...we eat the cost) is getting a raise this year, so perhaps I'm leaning towards one direction whereas someone affected in another way will lean another. Not all of us are going to be happy, some of us are going to be helped, some of us are going to feel it the pocketbook, some of us are going to be hurt.
    Last edit by Tweety on Jul 5, '12
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    Quote from azhiker96
    The law says that people can either purchase health insurance or they can chose to pay the tax. I'm not suggesting that folks are going to break the law. They will do what makes the best economic sense to them. From the link in aknottedyarn's post, the CBO estimates that 1.2% of the population, 4 million people, will chose to pay the tax in 2016.

    Why do you think that many people would chose to pay a tax which provides no coverage versus just purchasing health insurance which does provide benefits?

    I'm just suggesting that people will game the system if it gives them an economic advantage. I think people should all have health insurance. There's just some problems with the law that the CBO recognizes.

    Here's the link again. CBO Estimates Only 1.2% of Americans Will Have to Pay Healthcare Penalty ‹ I Acknowledge Class Warfare Exists
    Keep in mind that the law also waives the penalty (tax) for individuals and families that don't qualify for government subsidies but also don't make enough money to afford insurance. So there will be individuals who are uninsured and are financially incapable of making that phone call from the ambulance to purchase their post-accident or post-illness coverage, essentially a continuation of the same situation those folks are in now.
    azhiker96 likes this.
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    I'm not worried about the tax. After all, as long as we don't raise taxes on job creators like Mitt Romney, that wealth will trickle down to me eventually. At least if I hang out in the basement of a bank in the Cayman Islands...
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    Quote from Jolie
    Keep in mind that the law also waives the penalty (tax) for individuals and families that don't qualify for government subsidies but also don't make enough money to afford insurance. So there will be individuals who are uninsured and are financially incapable of making that phone call from the ambulance to purchase their post-accident or post-illness coverage, essentially a continuation of the same situation those folks are in now.

    Pretty good argument for universal healthcare and stopping all this nonsense and leaving needy people without options. Insure everyone equally and fairly.
  6. 1
    Quote from Tweety
    Pretty good argument for universal healthcare and stopping all this nonsense and leaving needy people without options. Insure everyone equally and fairly.
    You and I disagree on universal healthcare but perhaps we can agree that this is a pretty good argument for NOT bothering with the trillions of dollars already and about to be wasted on implementing a system of "insurance reform" that neither reform nor cost-effective. In the end, we will transfer trillions of dollars with little improvement in access to, or ability to pay for, health care. Millions will be dropped from employer plans, and a fair number of currently uninsured will remain so because they won't qualify for government subsidies. Some currently not covered will become covered. Many currently with insurance will end up without. We won't have significant improvement in the numbers of people covered, only change who is insured and who isn't. (Everybody stand up and move one place to the left.)

    We would be better off taking the tax money raised in the name of Obamacare and placing it into health savings accounts in care of those who currently are uninsured. At least it would go directly to its intended purpose and not be wasted on bureaucracy, enforcement and waste.
    jeannepaul likes this.
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    i wasn’t in favor of the bill, but do want to know as much as i can about it.
    [color=#333333]· the congressional budget office estimated that obamacare will reduce the federal deficit over the next decade. repealing the law would increase the deficit by $230 billion over the next 10 years. $210 billion
    [color=#333333]· many young americans have insurance thanks to obamacare. [color=#333333]http://money.cnn.com/2012/06/19/pf/h...ults/index.htm
    [color=#333333]· health reform will help create about 4 million jobs over the next decade, according to a 2010 center for american progress report, by reducing the cost of health care and making it cheaper for businesses to hire. the law will create between 250,000 and 400,000 jobs a year. according to the study, the law will help create more than 200,000 manufacturing and 900,000 in the service sector by 2016. -- read the full report here
    [color=#333333]· it will be cheaper for employers to provide health care. these costs are often passed on to customers. one study estimates that each car sold by general motors contains $1,200.00 in health costs. [color=#333333]http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/...the-us-economy
    [color=#333333]· small businesses already receive tax credits contained in the law to help insure their employees. -- [color=#333333]http://www.irs.gov/newsroom/article/...223666,00.html

    four reasons why the court's decision to uphold obamacare is good news for the economy | thinkprogress
    [color=#333333]· article “[color=#333333]obamacare: it’s cheaper!” -- http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2012/07/05/obamacare-it-s-cheaper.html
    tewdles and aknottedyarn like this.
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    Quote from Jolie
    You and I disagree on universal healthcare but perhaps we can agree that this is a pretty good argument for NOT bothering with the trillions of dollars already and about to be wasted on implementing a system of "insurance reform" that neither reform nor cost-effective. In the end, we will transfer trillions of dollars with little improvement in access to, or ability to pay for, health care. Millions will be dropped from employer plans, and a fair number of currently uninsured will remain so because they won't qualify for government subsidies. Some currently not covered will become covered. Many currently with insurance will end up without. We won't have significant improvement in the numbers of people covered, only change who is insured and who isn't. (Everybody stand up and move one place to the left.)

    We would be better off taking the tax money raised in the name of Obamacare and placing it into health savings accounts in care of those who currently are uninsured. At least it would go directly to its intended purpose and not be wasted on bureaucracy, enforcement and waste.
    Nope, we can't agree on much of that, but I too would be frustrated with bureaucracy and waste.

    There aren't many conservatives that show any kind of concern for the uninsured or any alternatives when they vow to do away with Obamacare, so kudos on that. Senator McConnell says the uninsured isn't the issue.
    Last edit by Tweety on Jul 5, '12
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    herring,

    I sincerely hope that you are right and that your optimism about Obamacare proves to be justified, as our economy and society as a whole can ill afford another expensive government boondoggle with poor outcomes, which is what I anticipate.

    All we can really do is to come back in 5, 10, 20, 25 years and honestly assess the state of our economy and the health of our nation.

    I hope everyone plans to attend these AN reunions. I'll be the one who looks a little like Sally Field. How will we recognize everyone else?
    herring_RN likes this.
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    Quote from Jolie
    herring,

    I sincerely hope that you are right and that your optimism about Obamacare proves to be justified, as our economy and society as a whole can ill afford another expensive government boondoggle with poor outcomes, which is what I anticipate.
    Hopefully we'll stay out of war and that will help. Defeating Romney and his promised tax cuts that we can ill afford will help too. Interesting what expenses cause outrage in different folks. But that's what makes us great, but what might be our downfall if we can't work together.

    Since I've been around 10 years already, I'll probably still be around but looking like this....
    tweety.jpg
    aknottedyarn and wooh like this.


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