60 Minutes engages in fake (misleading) news - page 5

I just read about the 60 minutes report on Remington rifles. I am disappointed they made such a misleading report. Remington Fights Back Against Fake News 6 Minutes Attack - GunsAmerica Digest... Read More

  1. by   chare
    Quote from nursej22
    I suppose people could say that ISIS terrorists are copycatting Timothy McVeigh when they drive trucks filled with explosives into buildings, right?
    Or we could say that Timothy McVeigh copycatted the Islamic Jihad’s 1983 bombing of the Marine barracks in Beirut. ; an attack that killed 241 U.S. service members, 58 French peacekeepers, 6 civilians, and the 2 suicide attackers. And, if memory serves me correctly, this wasn’t the first use of a vehicle in a bombing attack.

    I don't want to start a tit for tat over this, but people and organizations have been using a variety of improvised devices to commit murder and mayhem for years.
  2. by   azhiker96
    Quote from heron
    However, let's not get too self-righteous about this. We all know very well that, as human beings, radical lefties are just as capable of violence - up to and including murder - as any right wing ammosexual. As far as Antifa is concerned, bricks and broken bottles can kill too. Then there is the fallout from their intentional violent provocation. The idiots throwing the bricks disappear, leaving innocent bystanders and non-violent protesters to deal with the backlash. Doesn't anyone here remember the Symbionese Liberation Army, SDS or the Weather Underground?


    Leaving aside the equivalence implied by AZ's post - which, I agree, is a false one - I think that this was the point he was trying to make.

    It is the choice to be non-violent in the face of threatened or actual violence that gives us moral authority.
    Yes, I remember those groups. I'm sure you also remember Gandhi and MLK. I just wish more people would remember or learn about the great non-violent leaders of our time. I've often thought that if Hamas had taken the path of Gandhi they would have had a peaceful solution long ago and without all the suffering.

    There was an iconic photo during a Vietnam war protest of a hippie placing a flower in the barrel of a National Guard M-16. We need more of that today and less smashing windows, throwing rocks, and screaming insults.
  3. by   nursej22
    Quote from chare
    Or we could say that Timothy McVeigh copycatted the Islamic Jihad’s 1983 bombing of the Marine barracks in Beirut. ; an attack that killed 241 U.S. service members, 58 French peacekeepers, 6 civilians, and the 2 suicide attackers. And, if memory serves me correctly, this wasn’t the first use of a vehicle in a bombing attack.

    I don't want to start a tit for tat over this, but people and organizations have been using a variety of improvised devices to commit murder and mayhem for years.
    Good point, I had forgotten about that. But now I remember how angry I was at our President's response, or lack of response.

    But I don't want to derail this thread.
  4. by   toomuchbaloney
    Trump’s History of Encouraging Violence - Video - NYTimes.com

    There are compilations of Trump supporters at Trump rallies saying hateful and racist things. Trump was responsible for inspiring many of the racists to register and vote, the dog whistles were obvious.
  5. by   Lil Nel
    Quote from toomuchbaloney
    Trump’s History of Encouraging Violence - Video - NYTimes.com

    There are compilations of Trump supporters at Trump rallies saying hateful and racist things. Trump was responsible for inspiring many of the racists to register and vote, the dog whistles were obvious.
    His supporters at campaign rallies didn't just SAY hateful and racist things, they also committed violent acts at Trump's urging. He is currently being sued by an elderly supporter at a Kentucky rally who assaulted a protester at a rally when Trump urged the crowd to act out.

    The elderly supporter now claims he only assaulted the person because Trump said to do so. Lame excuse, I know, but the bottom line is Trump CALLED for physical violence at his rallies.

    Remember how he promised to PAY the legal bills of these people. Of course, he walked that back, because we know Donnie isn't going to use any of HIS money.

    Somehow, Trump missed the memo on MLK and non-violence.
  6. by   elkpark
    Quote from heron
    However, let's not get too self-righteous about this. We all know very well that, as human beings, radical lefties are just as capable of violence - up to and including murder - as any right wing ammosexual. As far as Antifa is concerned, bricks and broken bottles can kill too.
    Remind me again of how many people the Antifa activists have killed?
  7. by   heron
    Quote from elkpark
    Remind me again of how many people the Antifa activists have killed?
    That wasn't my point and I suspect you know that. I agree that the current "violent left" rhetoric is the epitome of false equivilancies and intellectual dishonesty. BUT the tone of moral superiority is starting to sound a bit pharisaical and that just perpetuates the tit-for-tat whataboutism that wastes everyone's time.

    Meanwhile nobody is even thinking about, let alone discussing, how it is that people become radicalized in the first place.

    As for antifa - they may not have murdered anyone that we know of. That leaves open the question of whether their self-indulgent antics help potentiate right-wing violence, putting all of us at risk. When you get a bunch of extremists together who justify armed demonstration by claiming to be the embattled underdogs bravely defending themselves against Big Brother, is it sensible to make their persecution fantasies come true?
  8. by   Tweety
    No one likes to look at violence from their side. The left certainly is prone to destruction and violence in some of their protests. Still a good deal of us, while not putting flowers in the guns of soldiers like that iconic photo, want to be heard peacefully. This includes BLM, the Women's Marches and such.

    In a world where vehicles are now a weapon of mass destruction, and a country where we have more guns than people, it's just a matter of time before a left-wing extremists causes some serious mayhem.

    People are angry.

    My main issue, and many of you know, I hate deflection. When talking about the murdered woman run down by the extremist, why is a discussion of violence on the left brought up? This was the immediate response of people like Hannity and Tomi "being a conservative is harder than being a woman" Lauren. Her vlog the next day was all about "yeah it's horrible she was killed, but are you also going to condemn the violence of ....blah blah blah (listing incidents of vandalism and violence by the left).

    As a matter of fact, I did condemn those violent acts, but why is it necessary that when I say "this is a horrible thing, and right wing extremism is wrong" that I also have to dig into the past of left violence? It's a deflection and it's an insult to the murdered woman.

    Yes, violence in America is a discussion we need to have, but the old "but your side does it to" and "there's violence on both sides" is not a good talking point.
  9. by   elkpark
    Quote from heron
    As for antifa - they may not have murdered anyone that we know of. That leaves open the question of whether their self-indulgent antics help potentiate right-wing violence, putting all of us at risk. When you get a bunch of extremists together who justify armed demonstration by claiming to be the embattled underdogs bravely defending themselves against Big Brother, is it sensible to make their persecution fantasies come true?
    "May not" have murdered anyone? "That we know of?" I'm pretty sure that, if they had, we'd have heard about it. This sounds an awful lot like blaming the victim, in addition to the kind of moral equivalency you say you're decrying. While I'm not defending violence on any side of this conflict, I fail to see how, when a group has been repeatedly threatened and intimidated and some members of the group actually physically assaulted, and some members of that group choose to fight back against the aggressors, that constitutes "self-indulgent antics." A lot of people would call it "self defense."
    Last edit by elkpark on Aug 23
  10. by   Lil Nel
    Quote from heron
    When you get a bunch of extremists together who justify armed demonstration by claiming to be the embattled underdogs bravely defending themselves against Big Brother, is it sensible to make their persecution fantasies come true?
    You just described the group of Bostonians who jeered at and harassed the British soldiers outside of the Custom House prior to the Boston Massacre.

    I say, thank goodness for those embattled underdogs willing to risk life and limb to battle Big Brother. Without them, the American Revolution never would have occurred.

    Here's to the embattled underdogs!

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