Don't buy a dog, not any dog at all. - page 12
Do not buy a dog, not any dog at all. Ha, the above remark, might lead to you think I do not think people should live with dogs, but, just the reverse, I think almost everyone should live with a... Read More
Feb 17, '13Quote from Jean Marie46514I've read it all, ITS ALL THE SAME ANSWERS, no matter what my question is the answer is akc and breeders are evil, clicker training or shy dog/DA dog. I'm not repeating my questions, although I would have enjoyed a good debate/discussion, but it is obvious that is not going to happen.gotta go, i'll try to catch up tomorrow, i hope i do not hurt anyone's feelings if i have not yet read their posts. I will catch up tomorrow.
meantime, pet2ppl, do consider going back, and reading the thread. I haven't had a 'new' objection now, in many many many pages...i'm just copying and pasting from previous pages now.
whatever you are thinking, might be it's been discussed already, previously, on one of the other pages.
Feb 17, '13This thread has gotten so entangling that it has gotten nowhere except confusing. Too many things are being taken out of context and are being flipped around. I suspect that soon this thread will be put out of its misery by being locked.
Again I don't have a stigma against shelter dogs, never have never will. I also do not have a stigma against ethical breeders never have never will. I feel that people have a freedom of choice and that they need to be informed. Not all dogs work for all people. Not all training methods work for all dogs.
I had fun this weekend stirring the pot some on this thread. I like frustrating activists and people with agendas.
Tomorrow I go back to work to again work at the job that I enjoy: working with pets and their people.
Good night everyone.
Feb 18, '13from page 14, top post... "i feel shy dogs and dog-aggressive dogs,
are ONE GREAT REASON to adopt ADULT dogs
that no one seems to admit is valid great reason to avoid taking home a puppy,"
I think there are many valid reasons to avoid taking home a puppy. This reason doesn't rank very high on my list but I'm willing to go at least as far as agreeing that it is one of the valid reasons.
As for your last post to me, Jean Marie... no problem. Incidently, Collies come from Scotland and England, and possibly Ireland, source sources say the border counties of Scotland and England which is were Border Collies originated. But it is unlikely their coats were developed in response to the weather because the they weren't excessive until sometime later than the early 20th century.
I'm not sure if you were talking to me about the shy syndrome thing, if so, then no, I don't know of entire litters being stricken with it or even every litter of parents who have produced it but I don't see what that has to do with my point.
I haven't looked at research in the relationship between personality traits and brain structure in dogs but I have looked at a fair amount of such research in humans. So far it tells us there is some correlation. However, correlation doesn't prove causation; even if there is causation, correlation doesn't indicate which is the cause and which is the effect.
Feb 19, '13Pets to people, i disagree with much of what you said, and i especially disagree with your interpretation of what *I* am saying, you imply many many things i have never ever said, not a once. You are putting words in my mouth. or "posts" as it were! I can't defend what i never said.
and yes, there have been actual posts on this thread, from people saying if one wants a working dog, or service dog, they'd have to buy the dog from a breeder,
which is why i said that isn't true. I did say that could be one of the more rational reasons to buy a dog, but, one can get working dogs and service dogs from the dog pound.
but, whatever. Is no point to reply to all the stuff i am disagreeing with. Like someone said, not everyone can learn new ideas.
I will readily admit, i am an optimist, and tend to have faith that my fellow man can absorb new ideas now and then. I also do not think many people in the general public are very aware of the crisis levels our dog overpopulation has reached. Maybe everyone or most of the people on this thread know of it, but, i don't think the general public knows how severe of a crisis it really is.
I also never ever see the harm in TRYING to help others be aware of a crisis. Even if i fail, even if not one person has begun to see adopting a dog as a good option for them, instead of buying a dog with an AKC paper,
even if i failed, what harm is done?
Feb 19, '13//"Not all training methods work for all dogs."//
clicker training works for all dogs.
as well as many other creatures. If anyone is having trouble clicker training, let me know, or join DogTrickAcademy. It can be done 'wrong', but, if done correctly,
clicker training does work for all dogs.
//". I like frustrating activists and people with agendas."//
I don't see trying to reduce the number of dogs being put to death as an agenda, but, maybe it is. If it is, i'm proud to participate in it!! COUNT ME IN on that one!! Proud to have that 'agenda'.
Feb 19, '13//". So far it tells us there is some correlation. However, correlation doesn't prove causation; even if there is causation, correlation doesn't indicate which is the cause and which is the effect."//
SUCH GREAT POINTS!! You are absolutely 100% right on that!!
However, the malformations found in shy dogs or DA dogs, are never ever found in any 'normal' dog, not ever. The more i think about that, the more amazing it becomes.
If if if they ever do find a 'normal' dog with the same abnormalities in his brain----- but that dog IS acting 'normally', it'd blow the whole theory, that these abnormalities are the cause.
but, til they do find even one (1) 'normal' dog with the brain abnormalities, it does seem to suggest there could be causal relationship.
also, like i've said before, there is a veyr consistent neurochemistry found in both types of dogs, and each type of dog, (the shy dog, or the DA dog) has it's own set of blood chemistry abnormalities,
it's not the same as each other. This, along with the difference in their behavior,
also suggests, it is two different disorders, with neurochemical causes at play.
//" if so, then no, I don't know of entire litters being stricken with it or even every litter of parents who have produced it but I don't see what that has to do with my point."//
Oh, i have forgotten who, but, someone seemed to have idea (or i misinterpreted their post) that entire litters are stricken, or that EVERY litter of pups everywhere, has 1 or 2 that are stricken, but, i don't think so at all. Sorry for confusion. It's almost invariably, only 1 or 2 of a litter, IF a litter is stricken at all, never the whole entire litter. (thank goodness, right?!)
Feb 19, '13I'm not good at training a dog. That is why i like to adopt an adult dog. Our Duke Dog cannot be in the house unless one of us can pay attention to him because he takes dirty clothes, used tissue from the trash, and shoes outside.
So we pet him or rub his tummy while talking to each other or watching TV, take him on walks, and play ball with him. He loves to follow us aroubnd while we are working in the house or yard.
We had one dog we took back. He followed our daughter home from work. He came right in and played with our Lady Dod.
He was so beautiful I just felt someone was looking for him so took him to the shelter with first bid if no one claimed him. I ran an ad in the local paper and looked for signs up about him missing.
We were able to bring him home as an officiel adopting after two weeks. The shelter had our contact information so we could bring him back if former owners showed up.
But he didn't want to be our dog. He would climb over the 8 foot chain link fence and come to the front yard to tease us. He didn't come when called. He would be in the street.
So I took him back.
A couple months later he ran upt to me, so happy to smell me. The lady walking said, "He is my Dad's dog. He loves strangers but shows no affection to me." He was on one of those retracting leashes.
The new owner walked him a lot too. he had a big yard he couldn't get out of. He also had one of those cardboard stand ups of Elvis in his front window. At Christmas it wore a Santa Claus Hat, Easter bunny ears, That Elvis was decorated for every holiday.
Feb 19, '13OH Herring, I understand, i had same trouble with my dog, only it was he ate poop out in the yard!!
you can clicker train that beloved dog of yours to leave the trash alone, you can. It's not that hard to do, BUT it does take about 2 weeks of daily five-minute lessons to teach this SOLIDLY to a dog, so the dog can be trusted even if you are not there.
Teaching "leave it" is done in increments, over time. I began with items my dog was NOT very drawn to, such a piece of bread.
I was near dog,
and bread was far away on floor. I only left it there for a minute at first. I set dogs up for success. We have to be careful to not ask too much, too fast. Reward BEFORE they mess up! ha ha!!
Over many five-minute long lessons, i trained my dog the cue "leave it". Over time, i advanced the cue so the item was closer to dog, and slowly increasing to more tempting items,
and over time, i was ever so slightly further away from the dog. My dog got the concept right away, still, i "proofed" it---advancing slowly---- by not asking more of him than he was qualified to do yet.
Now, i can put a hot steak down right in front of him. and leave the room, he won't touch it.
After Buddy fully understood and had mastered the cue "leave it", THEN i took Buddy over to various poops, and gave cue "leave it" and he got big prizes for not eating the poop. I did this for weeks to ensure he 'generalized' the concept to ALL poopies he found. Now, he never ever eats poop. Never.
Here is a link to quickie video to
very similar method of teaching your dog to "leave it". This is an all-positive trainer i much admire, named Kikopup. Most any trouble anyone is having with a dog, if you google the words "kikopup + name of your dog's issue" like
"kikopup barking" or "kikopup biting" or "kikopup running away" or whatever, there's a good chance that kikopup has posted a quickie, 5 minute video on how to solve that problem.
Here is one of 3 different videos on "leave it" from kikopup. she has 2 other videos, too, on same topic, worth a google.
Leave it 1- the most important things to train- clicker dog training - YouTube
^her method is slightly different from mine, but, she is great. Either way will do.
If clicker training is new to you, do google "kikopup clicker training" or see Karen Pryor's site. It does take some practice, the timing is crucial, but not hard to learn at all. No scolding is invovled. Use teeny tiny treats to avoid a full or fat dog. (i have recipe posted in somewhere in this "Pets" area of good treat to use)
GOOD LUCK!! YOU CAN DO THIS, HERRING!! YOU CAN!! Won't your family be so surprised when you have taught your dog to leave the trash alone? If you hit a snag, or a roadblock, feel free to post it on DogTrickAcademy, they are all clicker trainers over there.
Feb 19, '13I'll look at the videos and the site.
He is fine with distraction when we are with him.
If I try it and he leaves things alone, especially dirty socks, I'll be most surprised.
I can sleep with him on the bed but if he wants to get up he goes out. He has an entire room with a doggie door.
We're still talking about getting him a friend.
I think since we and he are happy it is OK as it is. I may be too old to learn new tricks.
Our daughter once got a device to teach a cat to use the toilet.
He did it OK with the think in the toilet with kitty litter in it.
But with just the toilet he sometimes did it on the seat and then tried to cover it up.
Feb 20, '13Herring, it's not hard to learn to use a clicker, it's really not. If you watch the vid, you can see how simple it is. It's only 5 minutes per day, too.
Hilarious about the cat!!
I don't know if this story is true, but, apparently, my grandmother, my grandmother was trying to potty train her pup, and in those days, it was not unusual to push dog's nose into the poop if the dog pooped in the house. Back then, humans might have thought dogs learn the way humans learn. So Grandma would push the dog's nose into the poop, and throw dog out the window.
The dog never really potty trained well, and instead, learned to put his own nose into the poop and then, jump out the window!
Aug 11, '16Well I do agree that not every person is a dog person. Especially dog requires lot of care and pamper and time and all that. And we RNs don't even have a time on ourselves. there are days when I do double shift and I just leave my dog milk and purina food in a different bowl right by each other. and my dog is so smart he will eat only if he;s hungry. I came across with people feeding dog with shrimp. are any of you feeding shrimp? if you are what kind of shrimp u feeeding them? I googled and found out shrimp is not that bad at all for dogs but only little quantity. Shrimp – Can I Give My Dog