30 year old planes for war !!Does this arouse anger and disgust in you?

  1. And disgust and anger !!! I was reading the n.y. times (www.new york times.com) article this morning about the deaths of the seven marines. the article said "most of the planes being used in this war are 30 years old." i find that insane, when i know we send Israel $7 billion each year in foreign aid. and then send our sons, husbands, fathers, and brothers to fight the arabs in thirty year old antique planes. the israeli soldiers fight the palestinians with NEW planes. !! go figure !!
    Last edit by prn nurse on Jan 10, '02
  2. 65 Comments

  3. by   Mkue
    From the article:
    The age of the KC-130 that crashed was not known, but many of the planes are more than 30 years old. Built by Lockheed, they were first used as short-range cargo transporters, but were later modified to carry removable 3,600-gallon stainless steel tanks in their cargo compartments for refueling jets and helicopters. They are also used to transport supplies, evacuate wounded troops and deliver fuel to ground bases.

    This is atrocious !!!

  4. by   oramar
    Most of them are probably over 50.
  5. by   Q.
    This is why my husband got out of the Army. He had stated several times that during the Clinton Administration, the military was allowed to atrophy and also suffered a lack of morale.

    Now the Army is pretty good at taking equipment and using them to their fullest capacity and repairing them - which they had to do since new equipment was not coming around any time soon (my husband was a tank mechanic) however their budget was so low that even workable parts were hard to come by. Most of their equipment was barely in working order, but it worked.

    It is my understanding, and the reason I voted for Bush, that part of his agendy during his term was to rebuild the military. I sure hope that happens.
  6. by   3651bht
    or youwouls go stark raving mad.... Hey maybe that's what's wrong with me....Hm.....................

    May the sun shine brightly on you, in peace, and may the wind be always at your back or something like that..............

    Hey with peace ya don't care how old the plane is....

  7. by   Q.

    You seem sorely disappointed with your country. Is there, perhaps, another country that is more suitable? Or did that patriotism that was flowing wildly and freely throughout the states after 9/11 diminish back to what it was PRIOR to 9/11?

    I sure hope you do vote if you are that disgusted with current government. That's the beauty of a democracy.
  8. by   prn nurse
    nearly two tons of fuel.....read mcue's post....refurbished to carry 3,600 gallons of gasoline (?), Jet fuel, whatever ! it is akin to riding in a 30 year old bomb. how many pounds does a gallon weigh? Maybe it is more than 2 tons....and i am anxious about being rear ended when my car has 10 gallons of gas in it...ever toss a cupful of gasoline on an outdoor fire....I have...on a pile of leaves....impressive !! and on the news tonite , they said they are still looking for the bodies....ahem....(ashes?) . we should all write or call our senators...e-mail....something ! those s.o.b.'s just voted themselves a pay-hike, and our fighting men are fighting in 30 yr old planes.....they should be ashamed ! Bush was at a fundraiser for his bro when he was informed of the crash and loss of life,,,,and his remarks are on the internet.."they died for a just and noble cause." (In a 30 year old remodeled plane carrying tons of liquid fuel) That is neither just nor noble.
  9. by   rncountry
    The one thing I would like to say is that we can't have it both ways here. You cannot have top of the line, brand new whatever if the American citizen is unwilling to pay the taxes that pay for the planes that cost several million each. On the one hand there is plenty of *****ing and moaning over the taxes one pays, on the other there is plenty of *****ing about crappy schools, poor roads, poorly paid or equipped military. Again on one hand there is plenty of *****ing about big government, don't need the government as much as the government thinks we do, but let the government miss something or not be Johnny on the spot then you get plenty of *****ing about that too.
    The planes may be 30 years old, but do you know how old the commerical plane you are flying on is? Not likely to be much younger. You do also of course realize how much each one costs.
    And Suzy I beg to differ with you about Clinton and the military. I am not a big fan of Clinton, though I think he did some good things. I do think it is a misnormer though to blame him for all the problems in the military,which by the way is still the best equipped in the world. My ex was in the military when the downsizing of the military started. That did not start under Clinton, it actually started in the last few years under Reagan. Multiple bases were shut down not only in this country but abroad as well. The military cutbacks continued under Bush SR. with Mr. Cheney taking a lead in what should be cut as well as what bases would be shut down. I know, two of the bases we were at were on the close list. As well as Barbers Point Navel Base in Hawaii, all closed while Bush SR was in office. It is true that the closings and downsizing of the military continued under Clinton, but it did not start with him, and some of the base closings in particular where slatted to be closed, and for some reason could not be changed, when he took office. Do I think that the military should have recieved better raises while Clinton was in office? Yes I do. Or new equipment? Of course. But then we come back to the tax thing. Under Reagan we had the largest deficits we have ever had in this country, it did not help that we had a horrid economy then, 25% unemployment in Michigan by 1982. Remember Clinton won by focusing on the domestic front and the economy. One of the mandates that were given was reducing if not eliminating the budget deficits, and holding taxes down. How does one go about buying new planes or other things if you don't have the money to do so, and deficit spending is no longer acceptable?

    I am not attempting to play a blame game of what political party did what stupid thing at what time. I am trying to simply say we don't have the right to ***** about not having enough of this or that, or having poorly paid military if we are also not willing to pay the taxes for it. And that doesn't mean so the government can $500 for a hammer, or to develop a coffee pot that will withstand G forces that would kill a human. It means be prudent and reasonable. Not something either party has always been good at.
  10. by   Mkue
    did you all hear that that plane HIT the side of a mountain? So maybe the age of the plane in this particular incident didn't contribute to the crash.

    I don't know.

  11. by   3651bht
    how the men and women who are defending yours and my country are treated.. Several years ago Parade ran an article that reported that a great majority of our service men and women were below the poverty line...Peace would not do that...............

    May the sun shine brightly on you, in peace, and may the wind be always at your back....or something like that...

    And it seems to me that most of you are disappointed with this country I don't start these OUTRAGEOUS posts.....See I'd like to see something better and good for this country...I don't happen to think it is violence.. I want something better for all future Americans... It might be peace.. Hey I was wrong once but it was a mistake....................
  12. by   nurs4kids
    as usual, very articulate and impressive post. I was raised by a man who taught me one thing, "Never vote to raise taxes. They raise enough WITHOUT your permission." Didn't mean much to me as a child, however as an adult, I couldn't agree more. I completely agree with your post about not blaming one party or the other, I voted for clinton, I voted for Bush. They're both politicians and shouldn't be trusted out of sight. I think Bush is doing a damn good job and I think If Clinton had kept his zipper zipped, he would be remembered much better. BUT, regardless of party affiliation, shouldn't those who risk their lives to protect our freedoms be given preferential treatment? Shouldn't their safety come before giving politicians a raise? You're also right about us not having a right to bitc8 if we won't vote for the tax increase. Here in 'bama, we have one of the worst education systems in the nation. Next door in Georgia, they raised their education levels by funding from a lottery. Here in 'bama, we're so damn backwards and lean on old morals so hard that we're blind to the future. The lottery was voted down because of a major push by good ole southern baptist leaders. So, although there's a separation of church and state, our kids and their education(responsibility of the state) suffers because of the church. My biggest complaint? If more people in favor had voted, it would have passed. So, the only time I think someone has no right to bitc8 is if they are not voting.
  13. by   3651bht
    And a contract with Apple to give every kid in the 7th grade a laptop this year and the eighth graders next year... WOW As Maine goes so goes the nation...

  14. by   nurs4kids
    Originally posted by prn nurse
    and his remarks are on the internet.."they died for a just and noble cause." (In a 30 year old remodeled plane carrying tons of liquid fuel) That is neither just nor noble.
    I hate when someone's quote is taken out of context, especially someone like the prez.

    "Our hearts and prayers go out to the families of the soldiers," he said. "But I want to remind them that the cause that we are now engaged in is just and noble. The cause is freedom and this nation will not rest until we've achieved our objective."

    FREEDOM..he is talking about freedom.

    I'd never know peace if I didn't have freedom. How about you?
    Last edit by nurs4kids on Jan 11, '02